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I love politics
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Raquelle wrote:
Bram wrote:
Raquelle wrote:
i like taxes and free health care n school
i do not like the forever growing consumption which is the goal in capitalistic economy shit
also i do not like too easy access benefits from the government
sry it’s been a while since i studied this shit i’m lacking some terms xx 
i said i'm a socialist so same b

socialism is not inherently anti capitalism
just wants to make it more livable

at least the socialist party i vote 4
ye
i like the finnish system a lot though of course there are things you could do better
i think it’s important to have multiple different parties
american two party shit is not it imo
20
Posts: 39262
Date: 08-09-2020 21:57
Private
Youtube star



devilcake wrote:
Raquelle wrote:
Bram wrote:
Raquelle wrote:
i like taxes and free health care n school
i do not like the forever growing consumption which is the goal in capitalistic economy shit
also i do not like too easy access benefits from the government
sry it’s been a while since i studied this shit i’m lacking some terms xx 
i said i'm a socialist so same b

socialism is not inherently anti capitalism
just wants to make it more livable

at least the socialist party i vote 4
ye
i like the finnish system a lot though of course there are things you could do better
i think it’s important to have multiple different parties
american two party shit is not it imo
america's not even a democracy imo
19
Posts: 186598
Date: 08-09-2020 21:57
Account deleted




wrote:
Cold War: VP edition

where we don't fight or kill (don't mind vietnam   !)
Date: 08-09-2020 21:58
Koolaid
Popstar



Koolaid wrote:
communism is by and large an economic system with political elements. but saying that is not really correct as 'true communism' doesn't have a government. now that means that communism does not inherently mean you will have freedom of speech, or freedom of politics (if there is no government is there even politics?). so yes, a true communist system can still be oppressive if not regulated well. in fact, marxist-leninist communism (one of the most standard flavors of commie) is rather restrictive (some would say even authoritarian) by modern means.
17
Posts: 14620
Date: 08-09-2020 21:58
Koolaid
Popstar



Koolaid wrote:
devilcake wrote:
Raquelle wrote:
Bram wrote:
i said i'm a socialist so same b

socialism is not inherently anti capitalism
just wants to make it more livable

at least the socialist party i vote 4
ye
i like the finnish system a lot though of course there are things you could do better
i think it’s important to have multiple different parties
american two party shit is not it imo
america's not even a democracy imo
america is a failed state
17
Posts: 14620
Date: 08-09-2020 21:59
Koolaid
Popstar



Koolaid wrote:
Koolaid wrote:
communism is by and large an economic system with political elements. but saying that is not really correct as 'true communism' doesn't have a government. now that means that communism does not inherently mean you will have freedom of speech, or freedom of politics (if there is no government is there even politics?). so yes, a true communist system can still be oppressive if not regulated well. in fact, marxist-leninist communism (one of the most standard flavors of commie) is rather restrictive (some would say even authoritarian) by modern means.
by modern i actually mean western/american
17
Posts: 14620
Date: 08-09-2020 22:00
Account deleted




wrote:
Koolaid wrote:
devilcake wrote:
Raquelle wrote:
ye
i like the finnish system a lot though of course there are things you could do better
i think it’s important to have multiple different parties
american two party shit is not it imo
america's not even a democracy imo
america is a failed state
capitalism but Make It Extreme
Date: 08-09-2020 22:01
Private
International star



Raquelle wrote:
devilcake wrote:
Raquelle wrote:
Bram wrote:
i said i'm a socialist so same b

socialism is not inherently anti capitalism
just wants to make it more livable

at least the socialist party i vote 4
ye
i like the finnish system a lot though of course there are things you could do better
i think it’s important to have multiple different parties
american two party shit is not it imo
america's not even a democracy imo
Can’t help but agree
20
Posts: 39262
Date: 08-09-2020 22:01
Private
National star



absintjente wrote:
Koolaid wrote:
Bram wrote:
Snusmumrikken wrote:
Is the time machine invented already
try going to north korea or vietnam or sumn basically time capsules

russia is basically still a dictatorship
just like
- belarus
- vietnam
- north korea
- literally almost every ex ussr country
russia is not really a dictatorship tho? like yea it doesn't have freedom of speech like america, but it's still significantly different from north korea.
same goes for vietnam and belarus
is this a joke?
the belarussian government literally kidnapped a large part of the opposition - including the leader - TODAY after a rigged election letting the president sit for his sixth term, after being the president since 1994. it is THE country in europe with the worst freedom of press and the highest death rate for journalists

and russia implemented a constitutional change a month ago that will erase all of putins terms, meaning he can sit as sole leader until his death. 

but yeah not dictatorships
21
Posts: 12685
Date: 08-09-2020 22:17
Koolaid
Popstar



Koolaid wrote:
absintjente wrote:
Koolaid wrote:
Bram wrote:
try going to north korea or vietnam or sumn basically time capsules

russia is basically still a dictatorship
just like
- belarus
- vietnam
- north korea
- literally almost every ex ussr country
russia is not really a dictatorship tho? like yea it doesn't have freedom of speech like america, but it's still significantly different from north korea.
same goes for vietnam and belarus
is this a joke?
the belarussian government literally kidnapped a large part of the opposition - including the leader - TODAY after a rigged election letting the president sit for his sixth term, after being the president since 1994. it is THE country in europe with the worst freedom of press and the highest death rate for journalists

and russia implemented a constitutional change a month ago that will erase all of putins terms, meaning he can sit as sole leader until his death. 

but yeah not dictatorships
that alone does not make a dictatorship, you could argue that belarus is authoritarian though
17
Posts: 14620
Date: 08-09-2020 22:31
Private
National star



absintjente wrote:
Koolaid wrote:
absintjente wrote:
Koolaid wrote:
russia is not really a dictatorship tho? like yea it doesn't have freedom of speech like america, but it's still significantly different from north korea.
same goes for vietnam and belarus
is this a joke?
the belarussian government literally kidnapped a large part of the opposition - including the leader - TODAY after a rigged election letting the president sit for his sixth term, after being the president since 1994. it is THE country in europe with the worst freedom of press and the highest death rate for journalists

and russia implemented a constitutional change a month ago that will erase all of putins terms, meaning he can sit as sole leader until his death. 

but yeah not dictatorships
that alone does not make a dictatorship, you could argue that belarus is authoritarian though
a dictatorship is literally defined as a single group or person having the power while allowing little to no plurality in the political landscape. so, pray tell, what constitutes as a dictatorship as if not two regimes who outright forbid political plurality?
21
Posts: 12685
Date: 08-09-2020 22:34
Koolaid
Popstar



Koolaid wrote:
absintjente wrote:
Koolaid wrote:
absintjente wrote:
is this a joke?
the belarussian government literally kidnapped a large part of the opposition - including the leader - TODAY after a rigged election letting the president sit for his sixth term, after being the president since 1994. it is THE country in europe with the worst freedom of press and the highest death rate for journalists

and russia implemented a constitutional change a month ago that will erase all of putins terms, meaning he can sit as sole leader until his death. 

but yeah not dictatorships
that alone does not make a dictatorship, you could argue that belarus is authoritarian though
a dictatorship is literally defined as a single group or person having the power while allowing little to no plurality in the political landscape. so, pray tell, what constitutes as a dictatorship as if not two regimes who outright forbid political plurality?
no it's not.
a dictatorship is a feature of a totalitarian state, which has complete and utter control over the press, its people, and its politics. an example of this is north korea. where mass state surveillance is instated, there is no political freedom or freedom of speech at all. communication with the outside world is impossible and propaganda is part of almost every aspect of life.

an authoritarian state uses primarily political crackdown on opposing forces and has limited freedom of speech. propaganda is present but people still have access to the internet and not every aspect of their life and business is controlled by the state.

an easy way is to say that a dictatorship is much more extreme than authoritarianism but that would not be an accurate equivalence. what you are currently describing, one person or group having absolute power with no limits, is called autocracy.
17
Posts: 14620
Date: 08-09-2020 22:40
Koolaid
Popstar



Koolaid wrote:
this is a very short (albeit simplified) explanations of the features of totalitarianism, authoritarianism, and fascism @absintjente 

www.thoughtco.com/totalitarianism-authoritarianism-fascism-4147699 
17
Posts: 14620
Date: 08-09-2020 22:44
Private
National star



absintjente wrote:
Koolaid wrote:
absintjente wrote:
Koolaid wrote:
that alone does not make a dictatorship, you could argue that belarus is authoritarian though
a dictatorship is literally defined as a single group or person having the power while allowing little to no plurality in the political landscape. so, pray tell, what constitutes as a dictatorship as if not two regimes who outright forbid political plurality?
no it's not.
a dictatorship is a feature of a totalitarian state, which has complete and utter control over the press, its people, and its politics. an example of this is north korea. where mass state surveillance is instated, there is no political freedom or freedom of speech at all. communication with the outside world is impossible and propaganda is part of almost every aspect of life.

an authoritarian state uses primarily political crackdown on opposing forces and has limited freedom of speech. propaganda is present but people still have access to the internet and not every aspect of their life and business is controlled by the state.

an easy way is to say that a dictatorship is much more extreme than authoritarianism but that would not be an accurate equivalence. what you are currently describing, one person or group having absolute power with no limits, is called autocracy.
david robertson's dictionary of politics defines a dictatorship as the following:
"Dictatorship is a form of government in which one man or group has sole and complete political power. [...] In the modern world many dictators have come to power as leaders of mass movements and have ruled through their control of such movements through political parties that have acquired a monopoly of power."

in their 2011 book dictators and dictatorship: understanding authoritan regimes natasha ezrow and erika franz defines dicatorship as "A form of government characterized by a single leader or group and little or no tolerance of political pluralism and independent programs and media."

i would like to read the source material that states your definitions of dictatorship. while authoritanism often is a part of a dictatorship, there has been dictatorship that arent authorative. these are known as benevolent dictatorships, and dictators found in these groups include atatürk, nasser, yew, kagame and rené.

benevolent dictators do not fulfill your check marks of a dictatorship. atatürk established agrarian reforms, secularized the country, adopted a juridical system not based on sharia, gave women the right to vote. nasser secularized egypt, nationalized the economy, funded the press, instituted a minimum wage and guaranteed 50% of the parliament seats to farmers and workers.

even though they instilled systems that are not authoritative, they are still viewed as dictators. because they solely held power with no room for political pluralism.

the thing is that there is not a big difference between authoritanism and dictatorship. but authoritanism is concentrated solely at a single person -the autocrat, whilst dictatorships necessarily arent. if anything, people try not to call russia and belarus dictatorship, even if they are, due to the negative connotations of the words. despite belarus being widely known as "the last european dictatorship"

think of it like this: an autocracy is always a dictatorship, but a dictatorship isnt always an autocracy.

thanks for the link. its not as if i study and teach history.
21
Posts: 12685
Date: 08-09-2020 23:21
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