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Defund the police
Saudade
National Star



Saudade wrote:
Azriel wrote:
Saudade wrote:
Azriel wrote:
Other systems ??? Lets ask marvel if we can use some of their people
I'm not sure if you realise but this comment is really ignorant!:-)
Right now the police are called for things like a homeless man sleeping on a bench, public disturbances, mental breakdowns, threats of suicide, domestic violence and so on, but creating new systems out of resources we already have like social services and mental health professionals will ensure these people get the help they deserve rather than being locked in a jail cell.
Cool!:-) social services and mental health stuff sure but u need the police or ull get white men going out with their guns for vigilante justice
If you refer to my other comments you'll find I said abolish and rebuild, I never said I'd personally want police to vanish, but cherry pick as you like. 
19
Posts: 25982
Date: 25-06-2020 01:06
Account deleted




wrote:
no, moving money changes nothing, i think the problem is that they have too much authority but no accountability and liability or good educational requirements. but regardless "defund" means too many things to different people and needs to get dropped quickly before we lose the election. we need to say reform 
Date: 25-06-2020 01:07
Private
Popstar



ouch wrote:
But tbh the biggest problem in the us at least imo is that there is no screening and almost no education to become police, its one of the easiest jobs to get tbh. In a more ideal situation there should be 4 years education AND a mental health screening to see if they are fit for the job and not just in it for the rush of power. Imo it is 1000% necessary to have police, even if 99% of them are bad, the world would be a much worse place without them. I think the system should be rebuilt, but not just get rid of everything at once and then start fresh but do it gradually or else there will be total chaos 
16
Posts: 95954
Date: 25-06-2020 01:08
Saudade
National Star



Saudade wrote:
Dracarys wrote:
no, moving money changes nothing, i think the problem is that they have too much authority but no accountability and liability or good educational requirements. but regardless "defund" means too many things to different people and needs to get dropped quickly before we lose the election. we need to say reform 
I think many things can be done and there is no way of knowing if it'll make much difference until it is done really! Whether it is defunding, abolishing or reforming I just think something has to give for a positive change. 
19
Posts: 25982
Date: 25-06-2020 01:10
BunnyButts
International Star



BunnyButts wrote:
ouch wrote:
But tbh the biggest problem in the us at least imo is that there is no screening and almost no education to become police, its one of the easiest jobs to get tbh. In a more ideal situation there should be 4 years education AND a mental health screening to see if they are fit for the job and not just in it for the rush of power. Imo it is 1000% necessary to have police, even if 99% of them are bad, the world would be a much worse place without them. I think the system should be rebuilt, but not just get rid of everything at once and then start fresh but do it gradually or else there will be total chaos 
Yes of course everything is over time, it's just the lack of action or plans rn from legislations that's the problem 
20
Posts: 22712
Date: 25-06-2020 01:10
Saudade
National Star



Saudade wrote:
ouch wrote:
But tbh the biggest problem in the us at least imo is that there is no screening and almost no education to become police, its one of the easiest jobs to get tbh. In a more ideal situation there should be 4 years education AND a mental health screening to see if they are fit for the job and not just in it for the rush of power. Imo it is 1000% necessary to have police, even if 99% of them are bad, the world would be a much worse place without them. I think the system should be rebuilt, but not just get rid of everything at once and then start fresh but do it gradually or else there will be total chaos 

ahhh idk if thats true lol,,,,, there is a lot of crimes committed by actual cops that don't get put on record or they don't get in legal trouble because they are under the shield of the police force. 
19
Posts: 25982
Date: 25-06-2020 01:11
Private
Popstar



ouch wrote:
BunnyButts wrote:
ouch wrote:
But tbh the biggest problem in the us at least imo is that there is no screening and almost no education to become police, its one of the easiest jobs to get tbh. In a more ideal situation there should be 4 years education AND a mental health screening to see if they are fit for the job and not just in it for the rush of power. Imo it is 1000% necessary to have police, even if 99% of them are bad, the world would be a much worse place without them. I think the system should be rebuilt, but not just get rid of everything at once and then start fresh but do it gradually or else there will be total chaos 
Yes of course everything is over time, it's just the lack of action or plans rn from legislations that's the problem 
You are literally saying u don't want police at all tho, which would just lead to total chaos and it being even worse than it already is, no matter how many "mental health professionals" get hired 
16
Posts: 95954
Date: 25-06-2020 01:11
BunnyButts
International Star



BunnyButts wrote:
ouch wrote:
BunnyButts wrote:
ouch wrote:
But tbh the biggest problem in the us at least imo is that there is no screening and almost no education to become police, its one of the easiest jobs to get tbh. In a more ideal situation there should be 4 years education AND a mental health screening to see if they are fit for the job and not just in it for the rush of power. Imo it is 1000% necessary to have police, even if 99% of them are bad, the world would be a much worse place without them. I think the system should be rebuilt, but not just get rid of everything at once and then start fresh but do it gradually or else there will be total chaos 
Yes of course everything is over time, it's just the lack of action or plans rn from legislations that's the problem 
You are literally saying u don't want police at all tho, which would just lead to total chaos and it being even worse than it already is, no matter how many "mental health professionals" get hired 
Yes I don't want police I want more funding into none violent actions and a system that doesn't protect domestic abusers, racist and murders while imprisoning nonviolent drug offenders for profit
20
Posts: 22712
Date: 25-06-2020 01:13
Private
Popstar



ouch wrote:
Saudade wrote:
ouch wrote:
But tbh the biggest problem in the us at least imo is that there is no screening and almost no education to become police, its one of the easiest jobs to get tbh. In a more ideal situation there should be 4 years education AND a mental health screening to see if they are fit for the job and not just in it for the rush of power. Imo it is 1000% necessary to have police, even if 99% of them are bad, the world would be a much worse place without them. I think the system should be rebuilt, but not just get rid of everything at once and then start fresh but do it gradually or else there will be total chaos 

ahhh idk if thats true lol,,,,, there is a lot of crimes committed by actual cops that don't get put on record or they don't get in legal trouble because they are under the shield of the police force. 
Well yeah, of course it depends how bad a cop has to be before they r considered bad but in the big picture I think the good they do (we r now taking away what awful things the justice system does) outweigh the bad, even tho there is a massive amount of bad. Of course if u just look at the media etc ur gonna b fed with all the bad stuff they do (mostly) and not the good things. I also don't like the system as it is now, but if we were to take out every single cop and replace them with mental  health  professionals and social workers etc there will still be murder, and probably even more of it imo, ofc I can't know but that what I think
16
Posts: 95954
Date: 25-06-2020 01:15
CL21
World Famous



CL21 wrote:
Saudade wrote:
CL21 wrote:
I think defunding the police would be so beneficial. My uncle is a police detective in a major city, and he often mentions that police salaries aren't great. If they spent the money on salaries of good police officers, more mental health screenings, and safety seminars, that alone would help immensely. However, what the money is spent on are things like swat uniforms, weapons, bullet proof vests, chemicals such as tear gas, and other similar items. If they are defunded, they will be required to spend that money on the officers rather than warfare-like materials.
The money being taken from the police could go to things such as medical and health care, both mental and physical, organizations that fight poverty, and education. Because education is funded by property taxes, poor neighborhoods with low property value are less likely to receive a proper education. Poor neighborhoods are also constantly scouted by police thus increasing the number of people put in jail from these areas. It is proven many times that education is the best way to fight poverty and crime. Increasing funding for education can help bring people out of poverty and lower the crime rate in these areas.
I've noticed lots of talking about the jail system in the forum. Defunding the police can free up money to reform the system and help prisoners in various ways. It can allow for good psychologists to be brought in, better living situations for prisoners, pay prisoners for the work they do, and allow for better educational opportunities for prisoners while they are incarcerated. In other words, defunding the police would help with this issue too rather than hurt it. Just some things to think about...
I agree with all this! Nice having an opinion coming from someone who has a relative on the job!! I really wanted to highlight that one line because its so important!!! Education is so important and there are kids who aren't getting the right education at all!!

I'm glad to give information. I've done a lot of research on issues like this because it's so important to me. As the daughter of two teachers, one middle school one the local community college, I can say with 100% certainty that education is the most effective way to lower crime and poverty.
19
Posts: 2208
Date: 25-06-2020 01:15
Private
World Famous



remains wrote:
finnish police spent 6million € on armored bomb-proof vehicles they absolutely do not need ever and dared to call it the "new normal" so yes defund tf out of the police not like they actually solve much crime anyway
22
Posts: 42060
Date: 25-06-2020 01:15
Saudade
National Star



Saudade wrote:
ouch wrote:
Saudade wrote:
ouch wrote:
But tbh the biggest problem in the us at least imo is that there is no screening and almost no education to become police, its one of the easiest jobs to get tbh. In a more ideal situation there should be 4 years education AND a mental health screening to see if they are fit for the job and not just in it for the rush of power. Imo it is 1000% necessary to have police, even if 99% of them are bad, the world would be a much worse place without them. I think the system should be rebuilt, but not just get rid of everything at once and then start fresh but do it gradually or else there will be total chaos 

ahhh idk if thats true lol,,,,, there is a lot of crimes committed by actual cops that don't get put on record or they don't get in legal trouble because they are under the shield of the police force. 
Well yeah, of course it depends how bad a cop has to be before they r considered bad but in the big picture I think the good they do (we r now taking away what awful things the justice system does) outweigh the bad, even tho there is a massive amount of bad. Of course if u just look at the media etc ur gonna b fed with all the bad stuff they do (mostly) and not the good things. I also don't like the system as it is now, but if we were to take out every single cop and replace them with mental  health  professionals and social workers etc there will still be murder, and probably even more of it imo, ofc I can't know but that what I think
You are entitled to your own opinion but I am disagreeing with a lot of what you are saying, and I'm not sure if you are understanding our perspective either.

Also I want to add that there should be NO bad cops in the system ANYWAY, and even more so - they go almost unpunished every time (even when caught on tape it appears)
So tell me, who is it allowing them to go unpunished? Who is it turning blind eyes? The good cops? Good cops let bad cops do what they do best - be straight up evil. And to clarify - I am not completely blaming the 'good' cops, as I know the police community can be extremely hostile and reporting against a police officer can be potentially deadly! Yet another issue. :-) 
19
Posts: 25982
Date: 25-06-2020 01:20
Saudade
National Star



Saudade wrote:
bones wrote:
finnish police spent 6million € on armored bomb-proof vehicles they absolutely do not need ever and dared to call it the "new normal" so yes defund tf out of the police not like they actually solve much crime anyway
bomb proof vehicles for the civil war they're about to trigger lol 
19
Posts: 25982
Date: 25-06-2020 01:21
CL21
World Famous



CL21 wrote:
CL21 wrote:
Saudade wrote:
CL21 wrote:
I think defunding the police would be so beneficial. My uncle is a police detective in a major city, and he often mentions that police salaries aren't great. If they spent the money on salaries of good police officers, more mental health screenings, and safety seminars, that alone would help immensely. However, what the money is spent on are things like swat uniforms, weapons, bullet proof vests, chemicals such as tear gas, and other similar items. If they are defunded, they will be required to spend that money on the officers rather than warfare-like materials.
The money being taken from the police could go to things such as medical and health care, both mental and physical, organizations that fight poverty, and education. Because education is funded by property taxes, poor neighborhoods with low property value are less likely to receive a proper education. Poor neighborhoods are also constantly scouted by police thus increasing the number of people put in jail from these areas. It is proven many times that education is the best way to fight poverty and crime. Increasing funding for education can help bring people out of poverty and lower the crime rate in these areas.
I've noticed lots of talking about the jail system in the forum. Defunding the police can free up money to reform the system and help prisoners in various ways. It can allow for good psychologists to be brought in, better living situations for prisoners, pay prisoners for the work they do, and allow for better educational opportunities for prisoners while they are incarcerated. In other words, defunding the police would help with this issue too rather than hurt it. Just some things to think about...
I agree with all this! Nice having an opinion coming from someone who has a relative on the job!! I really wanted to highlight that one line because its so important!!! Education is so important and there are kids who aren't getting the right education at all!!

I'm glad to give information. I've done a lot of research on issues like this because it's so important to me. As the daughter of two teachers, one middle school one the local community college, I can say with 100% certainty that education is the most effective way to lower crime and poverty.

Also, the police don't stop people from committing crime, they just incarcerate them. People are still going to do bad things whether the police are there or not. I'm not for abolishing the police entirely because there are good cops who help a lot, but their presence is not going to keep people from committing crimes. They may deter some, but there are other people who will still do what they want. There will still be people to keep others from doing bad things such as peers, family, TEACHERS, the government, etc. Again, I'm not for abolishing the police, just taking some of those billions of dollars going to them and giving that money to schooling and health care.
19
Posts: 2208
Date: 25-06-2020 01:23
Private
Popstar



ouch wrote:
Saudade wrote:
ouch wrote:
Saudade wrote:

ahhh idk if thats true lol,,,,, there is a lot of crimes committed by actual cops that don't get put on record or they don't get in legal trouble because they are under the shield of the police force. 
Well yeah, of course it depends how bad a cop has to be before they r considered bad but in the big picture I think the good they do (we r now taking away what awful things the justice system does) outweigh the bad, even tho there is a massive amount of bad. Of course if u just look at the media etc ur gonna b fed with all the bad stuff they do (mostly) and not the good things. I also don't like the system as it is now, but if we were to take out every single cop and replace them with mental  health  professionals and social workers etc there will still be murder, and probably even more of it imo, ofc I can't know but that what I think
You are entitled to your own opinion but I am disagreeing with a lot of what you are saying, and I'm not sure if you are understanding our perspective either.

Also I want to add that there should be NO bad cops in the system ANYWAY, and even more so - they go almost unpunished every time (even when caught on tape it appears)
So tell me, who is it allowing them to go unpunished? Who is it turning blind eyes? The good cops? Good cops let bad cops do what they do best - be straight up evil. And to clarify - I am not completely blaming the 'good' cops, as I know the police community can be extremely hostile and reporting against a police officer can be potentially deadly! Yet another issue. :-) 
Yeah I agree with that, I still think u can be a good cop and not report on issues within the community based on the backlash it can get. I also only want there to be good cops, I just don't want there to be none cops at all, or to remove everything and start from new, rather do it gradually so its easier. But there are also other problems, nothing will be solved by defunding cops because of the system around it is equally bad, so everything has to be fixed and that seems like it can't exactly happen so I settle for next best
16
Posts: 95954
Date: 25-06-2020 01:23
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